Canon/2010/March-June
Tag Question
Quoted by Prrton, March 1, 2010 ([1]).
Tewti, ma Prrton! Txantsana tìkangkem, txantsana aysäfpìl.
[As you can guess, säfpìl = idea, thought -- sä.FPÌL]
Lu awngar aytele apxay a teri sa'u pivlltxe...
« Teri » does not cause lenition. "Sa'u" is a short plural (short for aysa'u, of course): Literally: We have many matters that (we) may speak about THEM (or: THOSE THINGS)--i.e., we have a lot to talk about.
For the equivalent of "isn't that true?" "¿verdad?" "n'est-ce pas?" etc. let's go with "kefya [ke.FYA] srak?" or, as an equivalent shorter form, "kefyak?" (Derived, as we discussed, from "ke fìfya srak?")
Good Luck!
Quoted by Prrton, March 2, 2010 ([2]).
[Prrton asked how to express "Good Luck"] Since si-constructions take subjects in the unmarked (non-ERG.) case and objects in the dative, it would be:
(Fìtxeleri) Ngaru lrrtok! (sivi (Nawma Sa'nok))
For the shorter version, I like: Lrrtok ngar! It’s easier to pronounce.
A slightly different version: Aylrrtok ngar. (with an understood “livu”)
Cf. the all-purpose holiday or celebrational greeting: Ftxozäri aylrrtok ngaru. (Smiles to you on your celebration. That appeared on JC’s birthday cake several years ago.)
So this results in
- [whatever needs the luck]-ri/ìri ngaru lrrtok!
- [whatever needs the luck]-ri/ìri lrrtok ngar!
- [whatever needs the luck]-ri/ìri ngaru lrrtok sivi Nawma Sa'nok! (If the lottery winnings are at stake!)
Dual and Vocative
Quoted by Will Txankamuse, March 6, 2010 ([3]).
The dual forms are expected with things that naturally come in pairs. So if you’re talking about your eyes, ears, feet, or hands, you should use those forms. “My eyes” is therefore “oeyä menari,” not “oeyä aynari.” (I know a little Hebrew, and I think that’s the case in Modern Hebrew as well.) But what if you wanted to say, “Many eyes were staring at him”? There I’d use the regular plural; “many two eyes” doesn’t make sense. (But I should ask my Israeli friends what happens in that case in Hebrew.)
I agree that to say “I have two cars,” the dual shouldn’t be enforced.
[Will asked how to express the following]
Q: How many children do you have? (not using dual, because I don't know the answer)
A: I have two.
Q: How old are they? (now are you using the dual for 'they', or can you use the plural?)
As to pronouns, your hypothetical conversation is right on the beam: Once you’ve established that there are two kids, you should use the dual form. A useful guideline is this: If it’s natural to say “both” in English, then it’s likely you should use the dual in Na’vi. In the case of your conversation, the last speaker could have said, “How old are they both?” So s/he would probably use “mefo” for “they.”
I myself have trouble remembering to use the dual form when two people are involved, especially in the first person. One thing I’ve found that helps is that if I can substitute “we two” or “the two of us” or “you and I” for “we,” then I know I should use the dual form. Same for the second person forms (“you two”) and third person forms (“those two”).
As for the inconsistency in using the vocative ... well, let's just say that consultants like me don't have "creative control," and sometimes a bit of back-fitting is necessary. With the vocative, I've modified the rule so that it's obligatory when you're talking to people (including Eywa!) but optional when talking to animals. I think you get the point. ;-)
kxener and kì'ong
Quoted by Skxawng, March 9, 2010 ([4]).
As you know (I hope), I had nothing to do with the "Activist Survival Guide," which was written and published without my knowledge. Many of the so-called Na'vi terms in the body of the book are incorrect/misued. The Na'vi-English Dictionary, however, is actually my work, but it's an early, out-of-date version of the glossary that I never thought was going to be published. Since then I've made some changes, and one word that's been changed is kxener.
At one point the movie people needed some words for Pandoran foods for a certain scene (which didn't make it to the final cut), so I came up with a few terms. It wasn't important to figure out exactly what kinds of foods they were, so I simply glossed the terms as "kind of fruit or vegetable." I think there were about a half-dozen of those. Later, when the scene wasn't used, it seemed a pity to have these perfectly good words with such vague and not-very-useful meanings, so I reassigned all of them. Of the words in the ASG, "kì'ong" (stress on 2nd) now means "slow," and "kxener" (stress on 1st) means . . . smoke.
Pronunciation of oe
Quoted by Ftiafpi, March 22, 2010 (forum post).
Ngeyä tìpawmerì oe seiyi irayo.
Yes, you're right: the "oe" element in personal pronouns is sometimes pronounced in two syllables ("oh-eh") and sometimes one ("weh").
The general rule is that all vowels in a word are pronounced separately. The most extreme of example of this (so far!) is meoauniaea, which has 8 distinct syllables, all gliding smoothly from one to another.
But with the "oe" words, which are among the most common in the language, it's probable that more compact pronunciations evolved. People contract and shorten words all the time, especially the ones they use most frequently. In English, for example, "I am" is usually "I'm" in casual speech: two syllables have become one. The difference is that in English we change the spelling and punctuation to go along with the streamlined pronunciation while in Na'vi we don't. But the principle is the same.
So in careful, formal speech, "oeru" might be 3 full syllables. (And note that in honorific style, it's definitely 3: oheru.) But in ordinary conversation, "oeru" is normally "weh-ru."
The rule for these pronouns is as follows:
If the "oe" element comes at the end of the word, pronounce the two vowels separately; otherwise pronounce them as "weh." So oe and moe have two syllables and ayoe has three, but oel has one. However, in the dual and trial forms prefixed with m and px respectively, the vowels of oe are ALWAYS pronounced separately. So, for example, oel is one syllable but moel and pxoel are two.
Sìlpey oe tsnì fìtìoeyktìng* law livu ngaru set.
Trr lefpom livu ngar.
ta P.
*Tìoeyktìng = explanation, which contains the root oeyk 'cause' -- two syllables, stressed on the second: o.EYK. So tìoeyktìng should have four syllables: tì.o.EYK.tìng. I bet, though, that in casual speech on Pandora it's pronounced in three, as if it were tì.WEYK.tìng. Guess we'll need a native informant to find out for sure! :-)
Followup, quoted by Wm Annis —
Ngey 'upxareri irayo. (As you probably know, dropping the -ä on the genitive pronouns is colloquial and informal.)
